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	<title>Comments on: Thoughts - on &#039;foreign policy&#039;, terrorists, and power..</title>
	<atom:link href="http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/</link>
	<description>Journal : Critique &#038; Commentary: On the Human Condition</description>
	<pubDate>Fri, 18 May 2012 12:25:13 +0000</pubDate>
	
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		<title>By: khamis alromaimi</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-100945</link>
		<dc:creator>khamis alromaimi</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 24 Nov 2006 07:55:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-100945</guid>
		<description>very good discussion</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>very good discussion</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-77588</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 21 Sep 2006 11:17:21 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-77588</guid>
		<description>arif - well i thought  you were playing devils advocate to a certain extent..( which you do quite often! heh heh ) and i was sort of responding to you on that level. i get your drift in general - i've had similar dilemmas ( all the time more like)  and it often holds me back, which is often a problem. something to always keep in mind, but not to the extent where it stops one from doing anything. i do sometimes wish i had less of that sort of thing as then i could be much more 'right this the problem and this is how we're going to sort it' sort of person.. i can see problems ( though i am not eloquent enough to relay this textually) but i can't see many 'solutions' that aren't problematic in themselves. 

ah well!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>arif - well i thought  you were playing devils advocate to a certain extent..( which you do quite often! heh heh ) and i was sort of responding to you on that level. i get your drift in general - i&#8217;ve had similar dilemmas ( all the time more like)  and it often holds me back, which is often a problem. something to always keep in mind, but not to the extent where it stops one from doing anything. i do sometimes wish i had less of that sort of thing as then i could be much more &#8216;right this the problem and this is how we&#8217;re going to sort it&#8217; sort of person.. i can see problems ( though i am not eloquent enough to relay this textually) but i can&#8217;t see many &#8217;solutions&#8217; that aren&#8217;t problematic in themselves. </p>
<p>ah well!</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76359</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 15:58:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76359</guid>
		<description>no doubt..!

:-)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>no doubt..!</p>
<p> <img src='http://shorno.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Arif</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76320</link>
		<dc:creator>Arif</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 14:05:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76320</guid>
		<description>** you are "right", not "write"

Freudian slip?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>** you are &#8220;right&#8221;, not &#8220;write&#8221;</p>
<p>Freudian slip?</p>
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		<title>By: Arif</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76317</link>
		<dc:creator>Arif</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 13:57:37 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76317</guid>
		<description>Sonia, I think you're taking what I wrote a bit too seriously.  I didn't mean to accuse you of anything like setting up a party or whatever.  Risking the chance I might be accused of over-psychoanalysing, I guess i take your tone to be quite light-hearted and so I thought my comments would also be taken light-heartedly.  But reading back what i wrote I admit it is clunkily written like some sort of "i know what you are really thinking" rubbish.  Sorry about that.

Just to make it clearer, i agree with your arguments to a spooky degree, and that's why i commented... just to give you a flavour of the dilemmas I feel face me as a fellow-traveller.  

I'm wondering whether protecting our spaces for dissent leads to questions about how this will be done.  So you are write that when I write "you", I really mean "I".  And, err, one is sorry for invading one's identity! 

What is a libertarian to do?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sonia, I think you&#8217;re taking what I wrote a bit too seriously.  I didn&#8217;t mean to accuse you of anything like setting up a party or whatever.  Risking the chance I might be accused of over-psychoanalysing, I guess i take your tone to be quite light-hearted and so I thought my comments would also be taken light-heartedly.  But reading back what i wrote I admit it is clunkily written like some sort of &#8220;i know what you are really thinking&#8221; rubbish.  Sorry about that.</p>
<p>Just to make it clearer, i agree with your arguments to a spooky degree, and that&#8217;s why i commented&#8230; just to give you a flavour of the dilemmas I feel face me as a fellow-traveller.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;m wondering whether protecting our spaces for dissent leads to questions about how this will be done.  So you are write that when I write &#8220;you&#8221;, I really mean &#8220;I&#8221;.  And, err, one is sorry for invading one&#8217;s identity! </p>
<p>What is a libertarian to do?</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76268</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 11:00:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76268</guid>
		<description>I don't have any particular paranoia of 'takeover' or any such thing - perhaps Arif you see too many metaphors of the Nation-State wherever you go? :-) Words when written down seem to have more effect than when spoken - certainly you seem to take words voiced on this blog in some particular way - almost as if by speaking there is some obligation on your  part to psycho-analyze ( which is a very entertaining past-time in itself!) in a rather deadly serious way - which seems to imply it might have been better not to speak at all. That's my interpretation of a theme running through quite a few of your comments - and obviously there is a certain amount of truth to that - but again - everthing can be interpreted the other way - for example - not to speak could be open for another form of accusation that by not speaking you're 'supporting Them'.  It's obvious that no matter what anyone says or doesn't say they're open to 'accusations'. I personally think that's part of the cycle so am fine with it. I find it fun! I don't stay awake at night....( apart from maybe the odd giggle) But then again some people may shake their heads at my lightheartedness...!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t have any particular paranoia of &#8216;takeover&#8217; or any such thing - perhaps Arif you see too many metaphors of the Nation-State wherever you go? <img src='http://shorno.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> Words when written down seem to have more effect than when spoken - certainly you seem to take words voiced on this blog in some particular way - almost as if by speaking there is some obligation on your  part to psycho-analyze ( which is a very entertaining past-time in itself!) in a rather deadly serious way - which seems to imply it might have been better not to speak at all. That&#8217;s my interpretation of a theme running through quite a few of your comments - and obviously there is a certain amount of truth to that - but again - everthing can be interpreted the other way - for example - not to speak could be open for another form of accusation that by not speaking you&#8217;re &#8217;supporting Them&#8217;.  It&#8217;s obvious that no matter what anyone says or doesn&#8217;t say they&#8217;re open to &#8216;accusations&#8217;. I personally think that&#8217;s part of the cycle so am fine with it. I find it fun! I don&#8217;t stay awake at night&#8230;.( apart from maybe the odd giggle) But then again some people may shake their heads at my lightheartedness&#8230;!</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76266</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 10:44:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76266</guid>
		<description>"The more people who populate the terrain of your blog, the more you have to stay awake at night to make sure that there isnâ€™t a takeover by predatory capitalists or socialistsâ€¦."

i'm not sure what you mean at all - if i didn't have a blog i wouldn't have to worry ? How would anything be different?

"And however much you might deny it, you are supporting them by developing the discourse which legitimises the unorthodox and delegitimises ideologies of coercion"

who says i denied 'it' &gt; what's 'It'?   Who is 'them'? Perhaps you need to think more about what you say, just as I need to think about what I say. Of course you don't have a blog..so perhaps you're not staying up all night? 

In any case I'm curious as to why you're focusing on 'me' at all. Who am I in any case? Why not 'yourself'? I'm quite interested..</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The more people who populate the terrain of your blog, the more you have to stay awake at night to make sure that there isnâ€™t a takeover by predatory capitalists or socialistsâ€¦.&#8221;</p>
<p>i&#8217;m not sure what you mean at all - if i didn&#8217;t have a blog i wouldn&#8217;t have to worry ? How would anything be different?</p>
<p>&#8220;And however much you might deny it, you are supporting them by developing the discourse which legitimises the unorthodox and delegitimises ideologies of coercion&#8221;</p>
<p>who says i denied &#8216;it&#8217; &gt; what&#8217;s &#8216;It&#8217;?   Who is &#8216;them&#8217;? Perhaps you need to think more about what you say, just as I need to think about what I say. Of course you don&#8217;t have a blog..so perhaps you&#8217;re not staying up all night? </p>
<p>In any case I&#8217;m curious as to why you&#8217;re focusing on &#8216;me&#8217; at all. Who am I in any case? Why not &#8216;yourself&#8217;? I&#8217;m quite interested..</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76262</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 10:40:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76262</guid>
		<description>There is no such thing as the 'Sonia Party' - perhaps you've been taking Indian Capitalist's comments too seriously? :-) Or perhaps you're imposing your own view or reading too much between the lines...

Everything you say is ditto for yourself of course

And naturally by 'being' we - me - you- and everyone else - perpetuate the social contract we unwittingly find ourselves in. obviously..

Perhaps my language isn't as self-effacing as you think it ought to be? I do apologize..but hey. It's not the end of the world, could do 'better' in future but it'll have to do for now.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There is no such thing as the &#8216;Sonia Party&#8217; - perhaps you&#8217;ve been taking Indian Capitalist&#8217;s comments too seriously? <img src='http://shorno.net/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':-)' class='wp-smiley' /> Or perhaps you&#8217;re imposing your own view or reading too much between the lines&#8230;</p>
<p>Everything you say is ditto for yourself of course</p>
<p>And naturally by &#8216;being&#8217; we - me - you- and everyone else - perpetuate the social contract we unwittingly find ourselves in. obviously..</p>
<p>Perhaps my language isn&#8217;t as self-effacing as you think it ought to be? I do apologize..but hey. It&#8217;s not the end of the world, could do &#8216;better&#8217; in future but it&#8217;ll have to do for now.</p>
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		<title>By: Arif</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-76256</link>
		<dc:creator>Arif</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 18 Sep 2006 10:00:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-76256</guid>
		<description>Hello again sonia.  Agree that the responsibility that comes with power is more hassle than its worth.... for someone with a conscience.

But there are compensations for others, such as satisfying an urge to dominate.  And there are more complex moral motives, such as keeping people who would otherwise act very destructively out of power.

When push comes to shove, you would probably make the effort to support a lesser evil, even if you don't consciously believe in evil "out there".  Wouldn't you?

So even if you will steer clear of taking responsibility as a leader, there's still your responsibility as a follower.  And to say phooey to all of it is just as much of a moral decision.  The people now in power won't let you be a hermit, as they go about removing all models of living which aren't consumerist and which stand in the way of resource exploitation... so surely it is in your interest to support the liberal who has a leadership complex against the neoliberal.  And perhaps to support the conservative against the neoconservative.

And however much you might deny it, you are supporting them by developing the discourse which legitimises the unorthodox and delegitimises ideologies of coercion.  The more people who populate the terrain of your blog, the more you have to stay awake at night to make sure that there isn't a takeover by predatory capitalists or socialists....

What I have in your blog, that I don't have in a nation state (or non-nation state), is a meaningful sense of voice and exit as options if I disagree.  Perhaps that is something that foreign and domestic policy would focus on under the regime of the Sonia Party, allowing hermits and dissidents to go about their business unmolested.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hello again sonia.  Agree that the responsibility that comes with power is more hassle than its worth&#8230;. for someone with a conscience.</p>
<p>But there are compensations for others, such as satisfying an urge to dominate.  And there are more complex moral motives, such as keeping people who would otherwise act very destructively out of power.</p>
<p>When push comes to shove, you would probably make the effort to support a lesser evil, even if you don&#8217;t consciously believe in evil &#8220;out there&#8221;.  Wouldn&#8217;t you?</p>
<p>So even if you will steer clear of taking responsibility as a leader, there&#8217;s still your responsibility as a follower.  And to say phooey to all of it is just as much of a moral decision.  The people now in power won&#8217;t let you be a hermit, as they go about removing all models of living which aren&#8217;t consumerist and which stand in the way of resource exploitation&#8230; so surely it is in your interest to support the liberal who has a leadership complex against the neoliberal.  And perhaps to support the conservative against the neoconservative.</p>
<p>And however much you might deny it, you are supporting them by developing the discourse which legitimises the unorthodox and delegitimises ideologies of coercion.  The more people who populate the terrain of your blog, the more you have to stay awake at night to make sure that there isn&#8217;t a takeover by predatory capitalists or socialists&#8230;.</p>
<p>What I have in your blog, that I don&#8217;t have in a nation state (or non-nation state), is a meaningful sense of voice and exit as options if I disagree.  Perhaps that is something that foreign and domestic policy would focus on under the regime of the Sonia Party, allowing hermits and dissidents to go about their business unmolested.</p>
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		<title>By: sonia</title>
		<link>http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/comment-page-1/#comment-75605</link>
		<dc:creator>sonia</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 17 Sep 2006 02:08:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://shorno.net/2006/08/17/policies-what-do-policymakers-really-want/#comment-75605</guid>
		<description>the concept of equity for &lt;strong&gt;individuals&lt;/strong&gt; makes more real sense to me. and it's that point that seems to be relevant in then thinking about equitable resource sharing - i.e. why it's damaging for some entity to 'own' natural resources that each individual should be able to access.

i'm also very suspicious when it comes to abstractions over real individuals - don't know what 'blanket term' that can fall under. 

but then i'm a hermit who'd much rather live on a mountain than deal with fellow man. apart from to theorize and criticize of course..he heh. No doubt some would say i can't deal with the reality of life, and there's a good chance that's probably true.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>the concept of equity for <strong>individuals</strong> makes more real sense to me. and it&#8217;s that point that seems to be relevant in then thinking about equitable resource sharing - i.e. why it&#8217;s damaging for some entity to &#8216;own&#8217; natural resources that each individual should be able to access.</p>
<p>i&#8217;m also very suspicious when it comes to abstractions over real individuals - don&#8217;t know what &#8216;blanket term&#8217; that can fall under. </p>
<p>but then i&#8217;m a hermit who&#8217;d much rather live on a mountain than deal with fellow man. apart from to theorize and criticize of course..he heh. No doubt some would say i can&#8217;t deal with the reality of life, and there&#8217;s a good chance that&#8217;s probably true.</p>
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